Minocin/Minocycline Studies | Arthritis Information

 

Since Lev opened the door...lol...and Reader wanted some also...here is the first foray into the Minocin Studies I have.  This is the correct versions to the NLM and PubMed versions of what is on the Roadback.  If a link doesn't work, let me know and I'll repost the correct one. 

Thanks, Pip. I was irritated Lev was demanding studies , which he won't read yet again, and if he did read might not understand, since links to these studies have been posted on AI ad naseum, but I was going to do it anyway for reader, so I did, but you have way good piles of studies and a fresh, dedictaed thread was a great idea.

Rock on.

Hope these help you, reader!

If you have irritation Gimpy, they have medicines for that. I'm patient, I'm waiting for those multiple clinical trials. I'm glad that yous are going to post some clinical trials with-in the past few years because these that you posted aren't worth but a couple of bottles of ibuprophin. Looking forward to some better information. Please post some clinical trials that compare AP to biologics rather than to mtx or plaquinal and post clinical trials that address bone and joint damage prevention, you know whether AP prevents damage as does the biologics and dmards. Thanks in advance. There has to be standard clinical trials, right?

LEV

Pip, Lev - They are clinical trials. And there are multiple ones of them.Hey, levlarry2008-09-17 10:48:18So anyway Pip and Gimpy, Mino + calcium as a neuroprotective Well Pip and Gimpy, Are you in denial? Or does the phrase "multiple clinical trials" mean something different to you than it does to most people?

There are multiple clinical trials showing the efficacy of minocycline and doxycycline on rheumatoid arthritis linked on the first post of this thread.Gimpy, post them in there entirety along with the dates, what's so hard about it? Your smoke and mirrors are harder than that. Why are yous beating around the bushes? Are the studies that you are trying to pass off as clinical trials those that are dated from the 1990's? Yes or no. Yes or no, Gimpy? ??????

Why? Do the links not work for you? THEY'RE THERE. Is the idea you need people working around the clock posting stuff for you in response to your anger? You're just trying to start and prolong another senseless argument to get attention.


The links are there. The links work. The links take you to pages showing the full studies, the dates, the people who worked on them. They are published in publications such as the "American College of Rheumatology".

So what if some were done in the '90's? Are they supposed to do them again to get the same results in the '00's? That doesn't even make any sense. People do studies, collect the data and use it. they don't repeat them over and over. You obviously have never done even cursory medical research or you would know that.

Yes Larry, even though no one has posted several pages of studies for you because you don't know how to use a link, there are multiple clinical trials showing AP works.

And what do you care anyway? You don't want to do AP? Don't. No one cares.Yous are pathetic. So first they don't exist, then they do exist bu they're too old, and now they do exist, they're not oo old, but they're not a cure.

To quote Lynne49:

Whatever.LevLarry's "arguments" reminded me of an incident I think would be worthwhile to add to this thread, for people who don't understand the adverse medical politics surrounding AP, and why gathering inofmration on the therapy is slow (but still going on, and not just for RA). Here is an article outlining an incident which occurred a few years ago:



Drug Company Denies Harvard Rheumatoid Arthritis Researcher


By Alice Dembner

Dr. David Trentham is the chairman of the Department of Rheumatology at Harvard. He has used the antibiotic Minocin for successfully for many with rheumatoid arthritis and scleroderma. He decided to study the drug in those ages 6 to 14 and asked drug maker Wyeth for a donation of ,000 worth of the antibiotic. Wyeth, which made billion last year in total sales of drugs and other products, had acquired a small company that supported Trentham's previous studies of minocycline in animals and in adults. But this time, the answer was an unequivocal no.

''While scientifically interesting, the concept and design is not consistent with our current business objectives,'' wrote a company official in a letter that Trentham said stunned him.

While company officials later said patient safety was the reason for the denial - the antibiotic can cause some side effects, such as discoloration of the teeth - Trentham believes the letter gave far more insight into the company's reasoning.

Trentham's translation of the letter: If minocyline worked, it might compete with a blockbuster drug called Enbrel that Wyeth now markets for both adult and juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. Enbrel costs ,300 per month for adults and has life-threatening side effects, while Wyeth's brand of minocycline, called Minocin, costs only 0 for an adult monthly dose, Trentham said. And unlike Enbrel, minocycline is no longer under patent, so many companies could benefit from the drug's success.

As rheumatologist Trentham put it, ''It's a commercial decision, and it's unfortunate for the patients.''

Trentham said it was the first time in his career that a drug company had turned down his request for support of a study. But other researchers said denials are becoming more common as the drug market becomes ever more competitive.

''It happens all the time,'' said Dr. Raymond Woosley, a prominent drug researcher who is vice president of health sciences at the University of Arizona. ''They don't want you to study their drug because of what you might find or how your finding might affect another drug they're marketing. They want to control the data on their drug.''

While companies have no legal obligation to support research by doctors who don't work for them, many scientists believe they have a moral responsibility to society.

''When a company refuses to allow someone to do legitimate research on their drugs, we all lose out,'' said Sheldon Krimsky, a Tufts University professor who has studied relationships between academic researchers and drug companies. ''Their interest is in their market share, not in public well-being.''

A spokeswoman for Wyeth, however, said economics played no role in the company's decision. ''The decision was made primarily on safety,'' said Natalie de Vane. ''The company felt there were newer medications that could be studied that didn't have the side effects that this particular drug has. Minocin is contraindicated in young children and there were very young children in this proposal.''

While minocycline carries an FDA warning against use in children under 8 because of possible permanent discoloration of teeth, Trentham said that is a far cry from the warning on Enbrel, of serious and sometimes fatal infection or sepsis. Nonetheless, Enbrel was approved by the FDA in 1999 for use in juvenile rheumatoid arthritis for those patients who fail other treatments.

Despite the rejection by Wyeth, Trentham is forging ahead. He secured a ,000 grant from a small private foundation, the Road Back Foundation, to fund lab fees for the six-month study and will buy Minocin from Wyeth, and then charge study participants or their insurers for the drug. But he said he worries that that will make it much harder to recruit participants and will delay the study, now scheduled to begin this summer. He plans to recruit patients across the country who are not currently taking Enbrel or another treatment, methotrexate.

''It's terribly important to get to the bottom of whether Minocin works in children with juvenile rheumatoid arthritis because of the benign nature of Minocin,'' said Trentham, who is known as an antibiotic enthusiast.

Juvenile rheumatoid arthritis affects up to 50,000 children in the United States, causing painful swelling, stiffness and deformity of joints and sometimes stunting growth. While some children outgrow it, others fight the disease their whole lives. Doctors believe it is caused by a malfunction of the immune system and typically treat children with anti-inflammatory drugs starting with ibuprofen and moving to more potent drugs.

If minocycline works consistently in children, Trentham said, it would also be a safer alternative to two other common treatments for JRA - steroids and methotrexate. Steroids can stunt a child's growth, and methotrexate, often used to treat cancer, can be toxic to the liver and it can harm the immune system when given in higher doses than usually given in children.

Some pediatric rheumatologists said, however, that methotrexate is not as risky and minocycline is not as safe for children as Trentham suggests. A cousin of tetracycline, it commonly is used to treat severe acne. But it can discolor teeth and skin, irritate the stomach, and, in rare instances, it can cause liver or kidney damage and has been associated with lupus.

''We're able to control a large number of our patients with currently available drugs,'' said Edward Giannini of Cincinnati Children's Hospital, a senior scientist with an international consortium that studies pediatric rheumatology treatments and helped test Enbrel and methotrexate. ''I don't see much of a need to look at this drug, because we feel it's only partly effective in adults. But there's no harm in studying it.''

Concern about side effects of methotrexate led Melanie Masala to bring her daughter, Gloria, to Boston for treatment with minocycline. ''I was wondering which was worse, the disease or the cure,'' she said.

With minocycline, Marsala said, Gloria's transformation was ''incredible.'' As Gloria said: ''Before, not many people liked to play with me because I couldn't do the things they wanted to do. Now, I ride my bike, I rollerskate, I can jump, I can even climb a little.'' And Trentham said she is growing again, catching up to her classmates, without any medication side effects.

Scientists do not understand why minocycline appears to help some arthritis patients. A national study of 219 adults with rheumatoid arthritis, supported by the National Institutes of Health and published in 1995, found, however, that minocycline significantly reduced joint swelling and tenderness in more than half of patients, although a dummy pill caused similar improvement in about 40 percent. Lederle Laboratories, which then made Minocin, provided the drug and placebo free for the study. Wyeth subsequently bought Lederle and helped market Enbrel, which chalked up 0 million in sales last year.

Trentham, who was one of several investigators for the NIH study, chose to use Minocin for his new study for consistency, rather than other generic versions of the antibiotic made by other drug companies.

Getting free drugs for research is ''especially a problem when the company has a competing drug,'' said Woosley, a professor of pharmacology and medicine. He and colleagues were thwarted a few years ago, he said, when they wanted to study the side effects of an older synthetic estrogen replacement. The company, which he declined to name, refused because officials were worried the study would focus attention on the side effects of a new drug they were developing.

''From a business point of view, it makes sense. Why should they get involved in anything that might harm them?'' said a Boston-area researcher, who requested anonymity because he feared alienating companies from which he regularly seeks support. ''But the research community is trying to find out the truth, about mechanisms and side effects of drugs and how they are best used clinically. And the drug companies' posture impedes that. It's gotten worse year by year and the last two years have been impossible.''

Boston Globe June 25, 2002


Gimpy,

LEV

Oh yeah Gimpy, Larry is right. So why don't you try something new. MTX always works better with an additional DMRAD even the mild ones (like mino, like azulafdine). Why aren't you still posting the study with doxy or mino against MTX where is doesn't mention the MTX dose and I think it was 25 people.

Since AP has been around since at least the 40's, if it really worked don't you think doctors would be prescribing it? All my doctors knew all about it but only recommend it for mild RA. Do you really think 90% of doctors don't recommend it for most situations because they are all paid by the drug companies. Really? How come most of the very few AP doctors now recommend Enbrel too.

What amazes me is how scared the people are where AP failed to acknowledged in a public forum. They are afraid of attacks because of the cult like behavior. There are three here I that I know of, how many more? Its like the "tapers off MTX" that never happen.From the American College of Rheumatology: justsaynoemore2008-10-13 17:46:35Part II, from the American College of Rheumatology: justsaynoemore2008-10-13 17:53:27So, the American College of Rheumatology is lying?  If we cannot trust them, who do we turn for advice about rheumatoid arthritis?Yes. What's astounding is how vitriolic people get over this therapy with relatively benign side-effects. If they don't want to use it that's their choice, but why do they get their shorts in a knot that other people use it?

As to how long it takes to taper off MTX, that's a go nowhere argument. It takes as long as it takes. Every time I decrease my MTX it takes a long time to stabalise, but the fact is I have gone from 20mg to 7.5 with no detectable damage and a lot of painfree days. I lived this summer for 4 months in a camper van. I ran, I swam, I biked around. I can do everything I could do before RA.

I could probably go completely off MTX all at once, but why should I have a serious herx if I don't have to, just to prove something to some ignorant bozos, or these fine forum mates here?

My Rheumatologist and I are happy with the results of my drug therapy. No one elses opinion really matters.

It is unfortunate, and cruel, that some would try to steer RA sufferers away from this viable therapy, but anyone who knows the history of AP knows that's nothing new, and they will have to answer to thier own conscience, or maker, if that's what they believe.

If anyopne is really interested in the questions they asked, all the answers can be found in a book called "Why Arthritis".

[QUOTE=levlarry] Oh yeah Gimpy,



[/QUOTE]

He's a doctor trying to conduct a clinical study. The whole point of a clinical study is to show if it works or not. If he claims it works before he does the study, what does that do for his professional credibility? He's obviously pretty convinced it would work or he wouldn't want to conduct the study.

Lev, you're really not much of a thinker.

Justsaynoemore, My RA was moderate to severe and minocycline works on me.Perhaps that's because you are doing triple DMARD therapy............. [QUOTE=Lynn49]Perhaps that's because you are doing triple DMARD therapy.............[/QUOTE]
Yeah Gimpy, Lev, you liar.Gimpy, Boy, somebody should write a quick note to the American College of Rheumatology and tell them their website is out of date. [QUOTE=Gimpy-a-gogo]




"If minocycline works consistently in children, Trentham said, it would also be a safer alternative to two other common treatments for JRA - steroids and methotrexate. Steroids can stunt a child's growth, and methotrexate, often used to treat cancer, can be toxic to the liver and it can harm the immune system when given in higher doses than usually given in children.

Some pediatric rheumatologists said, however, that methotrexate is not as risky and minocycline is not as safe for children as Trentham suggests. A cousin of tetracycline, it commonly is used to treat severe acne. But it can discolor teeth and skin, irritate the stomach, and, in rare instances, it can cause liver or kidney damage and has been associated with lupus."

 


Boston Globe June 25, 2002


[/QUOTE]

Trentham made the comment 'if it works' about children.  He wanted to study it in children.  As our internal med friend says, "Peds is not just adult medicine divided by four."

(Funny how my then three yr. old was on the same or higher mtx dose than many of you adults...but I digress.)

This was also reported in 2002.   Look what they say about biologics in children/young adults now.  Adult are not growing and developing and won't have the same issues. 

As for my little Study of One, on Zithromax we don't have to worry about  discolored teeth.  No more Prevacid because it was just the NSAIDS tearing up her stomach. 

Find me a child on mtx and/or Enbrel not also on NSAIDS.........which, besides stomach damage, can also screw up your liver, and the PPIs you need when you are on them have been linked to fractures, right?.....

And I have to ASK to get labs done!  Ped rheum and ped say the zith dose isn't high enough to worry about her liver/kidney function.   Only the AP dr. wants that checked.

I pray that the day will come when Zithromax is studied for children.   I don't get what they are afraid of.  The ACR needs to give children an option for a mild DMARD, too.  They need it the most, don't they?

 
Suzanne2008-10-14 07:22:35If I were lying about AP, why would I cop to using other DMARDS?

I actually never lie as a rule, because I have good self-esteem.

How's your girlfriend, Cindy, LevLarry? She must not be giving you much attention for you to be so ornery.Suzanne, GoGo, JSNM, Suzanne and any other reasonable people reading this thread.  Let's get real here.  Lev is jealous that people, such as myself, who went on to develop RA from PRA and reversed on AP, or GoGo, who can do all she did before, as well as JSNM and Suzanne's baby, has obviously progressed in his disease because he is too damaged to do anything anymore.  We've all seen the pictures.  Lev needs our sympathy and pity - and we know he's no intellectual scholar.  He wouldn't be this wound up if he was happy with the road he chose.  Wow! How serendipitous.

Go, Pip!Yeah, I'm pretty stoked.  I shouldn't have started emptying it before I had a place to put it.  And amazingly, all the downloads from PubMed had something like 9u757w0476 in the descriptor.  LOL  Yeah, that makes it hard to find.  JSNM is the one that taught me to change the title of the study to the file name, but that was only a yea